Rogues Ruining the DZ?

[RaneMokeev]

Because the enemy of The Division isn't the Rioter, Rykers, Flamer, or LMB. It's The Division itself. lol

Hahaha, the Flamers, I love it  :15_yum:

 

[MrMcGinters]

Amusingly after all this was said yesterday,

Went online for a quick blast and no sooner than stepping a foot into the DZ 5 manhunt players were running around and several rogues too like WTF is going on the whole server is rogue hahaha

Happily for me I like this so systematically went around killing all turned out it was 3 large groups ( well 4 players per group ) who clearly didn't like each other and the in game chat was hilarious never heard some of those insults before and then I saw 3 people I felt very sorry for 2 x level 9 and 1 x lvl 6 who clearly had no bloody idea what was going on and were simply trying to run away.

They came running at me and i thought oh crap here we go but they ran past so I spun round to see if they were trying to shoot me from behind, Nope he stopped and shouted run so I looked the other way and OMG the screen was red and yellow with rogues running towards me :4_joy: :4_joy: of course I started to run and went underground those who could follow did and so began the slaughter I was really pleased with myself in dropping 5/6 or 6 before i fell. 1 guy I will give special mention too lvl 14 but he was a TANK TANK TANK i hit fairly hard but he could hit harder and was tougher and he killed me went to manhunt and run my answer to that was to respawn and chase. Explosives loaded and at him i went dropped him ( just ) and collected a silly amount of XP and keys and thought well done me   remember those guys who told me to run earlier they started clapping and being happy but this time it was me who said RUN as once again a wall of red and yellow players was coming towards us shooting each other and everything else in sight!

It may sound awful but it was one of the best nights playing I have had it felt like the film " The Purge " i died a few times but bumped up a lot of XP but my fav thing I started the night on 16 DZ keys ended on 32!!  Good good fun those lower level guys even got a few kills no one was hating or raging it was literally just a free for all which everyone as far as i can tell enjoyed.

 

[ESGN]

It's never about being able to kill other players or not. It's about moral sense and respect towards other players who do their own business using their own time.

I'd be more than happy to kill noob Rogues repeatedly like I did last time to give them a quick taste of what they did to other players earlier, which I don't think they liked it.

I get that, but if you want want to be left alone there are other arenas within the division to play. The DZ is the ONLY PvP arena in the division. So if you decide to go into the only PvP area then you inherintly take the risk of NOT being left alone by other players.

 

[ESGN]

Sounds like an amazing night McGinters.  Rogue fights are an absolute blast!

 

[RaneMokeev]

I get that, but if you want want to be left alone there are other arenas within the division to play. The DZ is the ONLY PvP arena in the division. So if you decide to go into the only PvP area then you inherintly take the risk of NOT being left alone by other players.

We know it's the only PvP area, man, we really do.  We're just talking about ways it could be modified to be more enjoyable for all.  Right now, only masochists like myself go in there solo lol but frankly, I have to.  I want to build the best character I can, and to do that, I need those blueprints available (currently) only in the Dark Zone.  Before I can get them, though, I have to grind to level 90.  I'm at 76 now, and that was done entirely solo...and I'm not stopping until I get to 99!

And I know, saying that you run solo leads lots of people to chime in and say you need to team up...well, as I've said many times before, I don't like playing with people I don't know.  I do have friends, but even if they didn't have wives, kids, and full time jobs, none of them own The Division!  So yeah, I might not change anything, but I do like thinking of ways the game could be made better for everybody.

 

[ESGN]

We know it's the only PvP area, man, we really do.  We're just talking about ways it could be modified to be more enjoyable for all.  Right now, only masochists like myself go in there solo lol but frankly, I have to.  I want to build the best character I can, and to do that, I need those blueprints available (currently) only in the Dark Zone.  Before I can get them, though, I have to grind to level 90.  I'm at 76 now, and that was done entirely solo...and I'm not stopping until I get to 99!

And I know, saying that you run solo leads lots of people to chime in and say you need to team up...well, as I've said many times before, I don't like playing with people I don't know.  I do have friends, but even if they didn't have wives, kids, and full time jobs, none of them own The Division!  So yeah, I might not change anything, but I do like thinking of ways the game could be made better for everybody.

My response was towards supercat and those that go into the DZ thinking they will be left alone. I know IT can happen, but when it doesnt happen. It doesnt mean the DZ is broke.  I understand not everyone has hours upon hours to dedicate to a game, but thats typically how mp works anyway.  The player that plays it the most and against tougher opponents will, and should be better then someone that is a casual.  I just dont subscribe to the notion that PvPers are ruining the only PvP area is all.

 

[RaneMokeev]

My response was towards supercat and those that go into the DZ thinking they will be left alone. I know IT can happen, but when it doesnt happen. It doesnt mean the DZ is broke.  I understand not everyone has hours upon hours to dedicate to a game, but thats typically how mp works anyway.  The player that plays it the most and against tougher opponents will, and should be better then someone that is a casual.  I just dont subscribe to the notion that PvPers are ruining the only PvP area is all.

Okay, I think we're sort of arguing apples and oranges here.  You're saying the PvP folks aren't ruining the PvP area; I'm saying maybe that PvP area could be designed a little differently.

 

[supercat]

Anyway....

This has been one of the biggest and solid complaint and there's a reason why something is being complained. The existence of the issue is undeniable, yet also can be easily fixed by:

- Narrowing the bracket down. This only result to a fairer range of strength between players. No more hamsters running around searching for foods in phytons' terrarium.

- Making two types of DZ session. Free for All and PvE only. This is the mostly suggested and also very considerate. Those who like to kill and getting tortured can still go in the default DZ. Those who don't also have their own cage to play in. Both win, everybody goes home happy.

- Change the PvE map enemies equivalent to DZ only after Level 30, with elites, veterans, as well as the loots.

- Or, the easiest solution, which also sticks to the base concept of the game: Spread the items evenly. BoO should sell what DZ vendors have with those currently-useless Phoenix Credits. To put in comparison, Phoenix Credit is rare to come by and has maximum limit. HVT, which mostly where we would get from, also have Daily and Weekly limit. While DZ is open to play anytime to get the DZ Credit and DZ Level, with a chance to lose it. Pretty fair and players can accordingly choose what they want to do anytime.

 

[ESGN]

- Narrowing the bracket down. This only result to a fairer range of strength between players. No more hamsters running around searching for foods in phytons' terrarium.

- Making two types of DZ session. Free for All and PvE only. This is the mostly suggested and also very considerate. Those who like to kill and getting tortured can still go in the default DZ. Those who don't also have their own cage to play in. Both win, everybody goes home happy.

Making a PvE only arena for the DZ, defeats the whole purpose of what the DZ is supposed to be.  Youre not supposed to feel safe.

What i dont get is why you should feel like youre build should be on par with someone elses build that has put alot more time into it then you have.  You guys keep going on about "fair".  Well the DZ was never meant to be fair.  And, nefing someone's build doesnt seem all that fair either.  Sure there are things that could be added/taken away to "fix" the dz, but i think narrowing the bracket will make the DZ less populated.  I dont know the how many people actively play this game on PC vs PS4 vs XBONE.  If the numbers ARE high enough that could work, but also keep in mind that GS calculations are weird.  I had a GS of 224 when 1.3 dropped. So how was I in the 231+ bracket?

 

[ESGN]

Or, the easiest solution, which also sticks to the base concept of the game: Spread the items evenly. BoO should sell what DZ vendors have with those currently-useless Phoenix Credits. To put in comparison, Phoenix Credit is rare to come by and has maximum limit. HVT, which mostly where we would get from, also have Daily and Weekly limit. While DZ is open to play anytime to get the DZ Credit and DZ Level, with a chance to lose it. Pretty fair and players can accordingly choose what they want to do anytime.

That is an idea ive often wondered why they dont do.  

 

[ESGN]

Okay, I think we're sort of arguing apples and oranges here.  You're saying the PvP folks aren't ruining the PvP area; I'm saying maybe that PvP area could be designed a little differently.

It could be, but some of the suggestions being tossed out there go against what the DZ was intended to be.

 

[DeadSockPuppet]

I ended up getting into an 8-man DZ group last night with a bunch of guys from the DZR Discord.  Had a blast playing for a couple hours and we'd even get like 2-3 supply drops and split them between alpha and brovo team and made sure that each team got hits on each boss for the drops.  We did pretty good and there were lots of green drops and caches.  

Toward the end we were using the rooftop extraction in DZ06 and got ambushed by 4 twatwaffle rogues that were all tanky-sticky bomb builds and they harassed the crap out of us until we broke up the group.  It was like trying to fight a bunch of tumblers, the bastards just kept rolling around until they refilled their sticky bombs and then they'd easily tear us up, since we'd have to group up to focus fire on one and try to kill them.  

And of course it makes it difficult not hitting the other 4 guys in our 8-man and accidentally killing them.  The rogues just had to shoot at whatever and were a rather big target, so that sucked.  I still hit DZ every so often, but I think I'll mainly stick to PvE on my main and run DZ on my lvl 15 alt. 

 

[ESGN]

I ended up getting into an 8-man DZ group last night with a bunch of guys from the DZR Discord.  Had a blast playing for a couple hours and we'd even get like 2-3 supply drops and split them between alpha and brovo team and made sure that each team got hits on each boss for the drops.  We did pretty good and there were lots of green drops and caches.  

Toward the end we were using the rooftop extraction in DZ06 and got ambushed by 4 twatwaffle rogues that were all tanky-sticky bomb builds and they harassed the crap out of us until we broke up the group.  It was like trying to fight a bunch of tumblers, the bastards just kept rolling around until they refilled their sticky bombs and then they'd easily tear us up, since we'd have to group up to focus fire on one and try to kill them.  

And of course it makes it difficult not hitting the other 4 guys in our 8-man and accidentally killing them.  The rogues just had to shoot at whatever and were a rather big target, so that sucked.  I still hit DZ every so often, but I think I'll mainly stick to PvE on my main and run DZ on my lvl 15 alt. 

8 man groups is difficult for sure. even farming npc's can be a challenge to not accidentally hit the other group.  No one in either group had 2 final measure to throw on?  I personally keep atleast 2 pieces on hand just incase i run into sticky builds.

 

[DeadSockPuppet]

The odd thing is I run FM knee pads and gloves and had additional bonuses to get my EDR to 68%.  Either there was more to the builds or I need some training on how to combat them, possibly both.  I'm also not too squishy, with over 390k toughness and 75% mitigation. 

 

[ESGN]

Was it one shot and you were down? And were they hitting themselves with the sticky aswell. From what im told, the more people hit with the sticky, thr more dmg it can output.

For what its worth, i would almost get one shot with 2 FM and 410 toughness.

 

[DeadSockPuppet]

Wouldn't completely down me but to go from full health to almost nothing makes me an easy target for a little cleanup gunfire.  I'm still tweaking my build to see if I can't shuffle some mods and such to get a little more skill points to help with skill regen and power.  My build works fine for PvE (what I mainly play), but I just get merc'd in PvP.  

 

[RaneMokeev]

What i dont get is why you should feel like youre build should be on par with someone elses build that has put alot more time into it then you have.  You guys keep going on about "fair".  Well the DZ was never meant to be fair.  And, nefing someone's build doesnt seem all that fair either.  Sure there are things that could be added/taken away to "fix" the dz, but i think narrowing the bracket will make the DZ less populated.  I dont know the how many people actively play this game on PC vs PS4 vs XBONE.  If the numbers ARE high enough that could work, but also keep in mind that GS calculations are weird.  I had a GS of 224 when 1.3 dropped. So how was I in the 231+ bracket?

It's not always that someone has put in more time.  Sometimes they've glitched.  Or sometimes the RNG gods were with them and they got lucky.  Or they had friends who could play Challenge Incursions every night.  A player could spend lots of time playing and not be well enough equipped for the DZ.

Which is to say, you're right.  The DZ isn't fair.  Right now, the solution is "git gud" or get out.  That kinda sucks for a lot of people.

 

[ESGN]

Time isnt everything but it does help a lot. You learn tactics on how to fight players, what routes to take to avoid players if necessary and how to use npc's to your advantage at times.  You learn placement of items/chests/bosses to better your odds of getting a good drop.  You learn where you want to be located when supply drops come in.  Time teaches alot of things that RNGesus and Glitching doesnt.  

 

[Falcon64]

They should have a section in the DZ specific to PVP and PVE.    I don't mind fighting over Supply Drops. But working hard in DZ 06 for better loot just to have someone cut the rope, come on man! Adding the cut the rope feature was a bad idea.  Also how about not advertising the location of the extraction on the map. That seems like some they can do will a small patch. 

It would be cool to have a gear set for just dz runs.  That would stop advertising  exzones, another one would be you can not be heard by a rouges players. maybe a locked backpack so you don't lose you gear.  they can call it the grinder gear set. what ya think